Cockpit Show us your Simulator Cockpit setup

Interesting............Very interesting

New to this sim racing business but it's heaps of fun.
Tovey has been helping me set up a decent rig

And this is my lovely boyfriend tovey_4saken's rig

what you cant see is the shifter paddles are wall brackets from bunnings tarzan taped onto the g27 shifters lol could drill them on but just incase i want to sell it in future.and the pedals have stiffened springs could almost snap a toe on the brake and clutch,gas pedal has clutch spring in it much more control

We have a girl now in the league? How good is that... Welcome Jan!

Thanks looking forward to starting on Sunday at the meet and greet hopefully I can learn some stuff from you guys never raced with real people yet only the Ai lol

That is very interesting indeed.

Though I'm very skeptical, and honestly think it's a load of rubbish. I don't think the guy who wrote that is trying to pull anyone's leg, and he honestly thinks he's right, but it's just illogical. There are also complete flaws is his working and the graphs.

The proof is all in the graphs.

Take a look at the first graph. Does it even make sense? No, it doesn't. According to the legend, setting FFB at 100% means that the FFB you receive will apparently be maxed out at 20%. And if you set FFB at 20%, you get 5 times more force! Wow! (Force (N) is on the Y-axis, so apparently FFB SET at 100% GIVES you 20%). I'll give him the benefit of the doubt that he mixed them up for now.

The second graph illustrates the problem more. The two solid lines are fine, and they illustrate how FFB would be cut off on a wheel that isn't scaled well. But here's the kicker: the dotted line reads in the legend "what you're missing @100%". But guess what? This line should also say "what you're missing @20%". Because you are in fact missing out on all that force no matter what setting you use. The wheel for that example is obviously terrible, and can't output much force at all. I bet right now you're yelling at me in your head, thinking "No you idiot! You're missing the point! The OP isn't talking about lost force! The OP is talking about loss of feel! The difference between the steering angles!" And I agree.

This is the important part: I don't actually know whether the PC simulators are that high tech that they don't scale by themselves, but when you connect to a PlayStation, the wheel will scale itself.

Games and wheels are made knowing most consumers don't actually know how the settings work exactly. To suggest that a game like Gran Turismo just chucks out a unitary 'desired force' amount at any one time without scaling is incredibly absurd. It is already scaled to your wheel. Trust me on that. I'd put money on that being the reason PlayStation games need to have a 'supported wheel' list. The output strength a wheel can do is known by developers and what not, and all forces are scaled. The best way of thinking about this is that the game outputs not '3,000 N' (to use the OP's scale example), but it actually outputs '60%' in the code. That's how the devs can give the similar 'feel' of the steering for every wheel regardless of the power.

An example (with made up values that aren't realistically scaled - I bet all wheels are actually pretty close):

3 wheels -
Logitech - 60 N max force
Thrustmaster - 100 N max force
Fanatec - 150 N max force

(or call them X,Y,Z - it makes no difference)

The game doesn't just 'screw over' people with a Logitech by making the game's 'max force output' 100N. It scales the curve, to try and MAXIMISE the FEEL for the WHEEL itself. Likewise, they don't screw over Fanatec users by maxing it 100N only. They will upscale the range if need be (though not all the RANGE of the Fanatec will be used (0 - 150), the FORCE of 150 N will).

This is why you invest in a stronger wheel. The range of forces possible will be widened with the more force available, whereas users with a smaller ranged wheel (a less strong Logitech) have to make do with a far more saturated 'force curve' - ie. less differentiation between forces because there is less range to work with.

What does this mean for the discussion? It means because force IS scaled on console, you are shooting yourself in the foot using less than 100% FFB. You are deliberately downscaling the force so there is less range and less difference between the forces.

The only time I've made force feedback lower than 100% is where the GAME doesn't have adequate FFB simulation, not the wheel. The best example I can think of is where the effects of kerbs on F1 2013 is ridiculously too high on the curve, so I needed to lower the max because everytime you run on a kerb, the game wants to put huge vibration on (equating to very high FFB on the wheel's range), and it was so violent and sudden that you couldn't hold the wheel still and it would jolt the steering causing milliseconds to be lost in game as you try to regain control. It's important to note that if you make FFB the highest, you 'notice' the power more with things like sudden jerk simulation like kerbs and collisions. The FFB generated with the change of steering angles is far more easy to cope with since you expect the force.

I'm sure in some advanced settings on PC sims you could really screw up your forces, but not on console. Ever. It's very optimised on a per wheel basis. That's why some wheels feel better on different settings. It has nothing to do with the power/force.

Hmmm, I was under the impression the article was aimed at PC sims, and not really applicable to console racing purely based on the lack of detailed physics available, sure there's physics data there otherwise we wouldn't feel any FFB, and Im not saying that the FFB in GT6 is bad, it's quite good considering it's probably based on minimal car physics data in comparison to say Assetto Corsa. If you have a PC based Sim maybe give it a try, I have and can say that it softens everything way to much on my CSW, but it's a different beast in the way you can tinker with FFB affects, so I run my FFb at around 65% this way I have plenty of affects coming through the wheel, and enough headroom to eliminate any possible clipping. Mind you this is on the PC, on PS3 the G25 is at 100%, feels fine to me

Back on topic

For those that haven't seen the new addition to my rig...................... Here it is!!

Isn't that a sweet looking H/brake.

It even works really well , Im very impressed with this new toy, and if you can afford the luxury of this unit, by all means indulge yourself you wont regret it
Cheers

Tl;dr version of my post:

Like what AJ said, on a console, it doesn't matter. It's scaled.
-

As for that handbrake, OMG that's so cool and high-tech looking! Jeez, that's a real indulgence there AJ! How often would you use that?

It's a bonus in AC when launching a drift, pity I cant drift very well, but the H/brake does an awesome job. Tried it in Dirt3 and its smooth as silk in it's application, all depends on how quick & hard you pull the lever. I'm more than happy with it

Cheers

Hi,

just signed up today and this is my racing cockpit.

Here is a pic of my latest rigs. I have been lucky enough to get 2 complete setups so been enjoying some head to head drifting and racing with mates.

This is my sim rig. Bought the Next Level Racing Wheel Stand a couple of years ago. Added the V2 GT Ultimate racing seat a few months back after I got sick and tired of my computer chair moving all the time. I did have the simrig setup with monitor stands, but getting the monitors to line up the way I wanted was problematic, so I decided to use a desk with the rig instead. The switch was done in the last week or so, so there is a lack of cable management.



Added a DSD 2014 Track Boss button box in the last month or so. Printed out the labels I wanted on a colour laser printer onto adhesive paper, cut out and stuck the labels where I wanted them. I have speedo/telemetry on a donated HTC phone running Dashboard Pro app. Use my ol' iPhone 4 as a speedo on the wheel, using the sin:speed app. Mounted an old iPhone 4 case, using double sided tape and some spare bits of metal to the back of the wheel (mounted on the back of the steering wheel, on either side of the "shaft"). Pretty solid and the phone hasn't fallen off.



Driver POV. Using an old iPad for telemetry on the right, using the pCars Dash app

Wow good kit