ACC Where to go

Discussion in 'ACLOZ Past Seasons' started by squid, May 25, 2020.

  1. squid

    squid Rookie

    Posts:
    58
    Likes:
    42
    Excuse the giant wall of text.

    Just making this post after pulling out of the Monday night Paul Ricard. I decided not to run for a couple of reasons:
    1. I did a really bad re-entry towards the end of practice and smacked into someone. (My bad again)
    2. I was nearly 7 seconds lower than the fastest time, and 3 seconds off whoever was next. I figured the best case was I came last, worst case was I was going to ruin someone's race.
    Number one I know how to fix, it's just practice and concentration. I get nervous around other cars and do stupid things. However, where I'd like to get some help is number two.
    In real life, I think I'm a fairly good driver. I spent my early 20's driving an MX5 like it was stolen, through the twisty parts of the hills in Adelaide. Following that, I also ran about 15 laps in a single seater in Yas Marina (and was by far the fastest tourist in the session), and I've also had the opportunity to do a full day rally course.
    However, i'm really struggling to find pace in the sims. I feel like I've done as much of the physical stuff that I can (removing stupid rubber stopper from G920 pedals, setting FOV correctly etc). I also did a season of MX5's in iRacing, which I enjoyed. However, that sim hits the wallet way too hard for me to continue (and doesn't feel nearly as good as ACC does to me).
    Before joining again this season, I did a fair few laps with about 8 different cars before settling on the McLaren. The McLaren wasn't the fastest one I drove, but it was the one I felt 'drove' best. I didn't feel like I was fighting against it, and also found I could recover any 'moments' without too much hassle. I had put a fair bit of practice into Nurburgring, Paul Ricard, and Kyalami. Fastest Kyalami time in the McLaren is a 1.46.4. My practice usually consists of a few shorter (5lap) stints to get a feel for the track (using the aggressive setup). Then, I'll continue doing shorter stints to get the tyre pressures set right. Once I'm happy with tyre pressures, I'll start running longer stints to make sure the whole thing doesn't come apart. I don't tend to mess with the setup more than that, because I can never tell if it's the car, or my driving.
    I think I'm pretty comfortable with how I'm meant to be driving the car, with things like the ideal line, using the pedals to help steer it, being smooth etc. I know I definitely have some work to do in this area, but using Paul Ricard as an example, I genuinely don't know where I'm going to find 3+ seconds a lap.
    What I would really like to get some advice on is, what do I need to change to get at least remotely close to the pace. I'm not expecting to be running at the front of the grid in a week, but 3 seconds off the next slowest time is way too slow. I'm also worried I'm just practising bad habits at the moment.
    Thanks in advance for reading, especially if you made it to this point.
    krunch, KoAStR, Rolz and 1 other person like this.
  2. marty

    marty AC Server Legend

    Posts:
    1,631
    Likes:
    2,417
    I think posting a replay of some of your laps with the wheel and pedal inputs, some may be able to help you out and see where a good amount of that time is going. Also check the basics like your throttle, brake or clutch pedal not spiking or short of full travel.
    krunch and squid like this.
  3. squid

    squid Rookie

    Posts:
    58
    Likes:
    42
    Thanks mate, i'll double check the pedals, although I don't think that's the issue. I'll run some budapest laps until I'm feeling OK with it and put a replay up.
    marty likes this.
  4. Wally

    Wally Team Driver

    Posts:
    334
    Likes:
    638
    I know your pain, from the perspective of someone who's always 3 seconds off the front pace. If you want to get technical, you can also post up a telemetry file from a stint, and get someone else's to compare it to. I can help you with that if you like. It really shows up things like losing 0.5 seconds at one particular corner because you're braking way too late, etc. But as Marty suggested, a video would be the best first step.
    marty and krunch like this.
  5. SteveDrivingSlowly

    SteveDrivingSlowly ACC Results Ste(ve)ward

    Posts:
    832
    Likes:
    1,333
    I'm in the same boat but I've had a few moments where I could almost see how it might be done. Usually I'm 2-3 seconds off the pace nowadays, often more, but at the start of last season I was definitely 5-7 seconds off and feeling very much like I was in the way/dangerous to others. I'm not an authority on driving fast at all, but I've just gone through the challenge it sounds like you are going through now. A few things have changed/sunk in for me since last season:

    • Every time you feel you have hit a wall and can't go faster, you are about to make a great discovery. Keep digging!
    • Hot lapping doesn't improve your racing much, it can help with confidence and track knowledge and improving your personal bests but not really racing or consistency. The perfect stable conditions encourage you to learn the solution to only that one set of conditions - at the expense of learning about what the car actually feels like when it is under or on...or even over the limit in general. Racing in unstable/changeable conditions allows you to learn more about how the car feels and how you can predict and react to that...much more useful!
    • Running a lot of races with other people as well as the AI (not just the AI) is about the only way to become comfortable and confident around other cars. This helps in many ways - knowing how the car will handle when you are off the racing line, knowing when to brake when someone has destroyed the markers, knowing what the car feels like 45 minutes into a stint, becoming a safe driver when under a blue flag - these are super important things that you have to be out there with a bunch of people(or robots kind of) on track to learn
    • You do not need to adjust the aggressive set-ups in about 98% of cases. I have very modest abilities and just had my one year in sim racing anniversary (yeay) and I have been able to get my PB lap times down to around 2 seconds off the top guys here in some cases. This is enough to get you right in the battles in the SILVER class here which is very competitive - and that is all with just adjusting tyre pressures. Focus on driving not on set-up tweaks.
    • The 2% exception to the above for me has been in very rare circumstances when I really felt like the car was holding me back. I'm driving the Lexus this season and for some reason the aggressive set-up was absolutely horrible for me around Bathurst, so I spent a lot of time working on aero and suspension (as well as my driving) and I went from terrifying and inconsistent mid 2:04's to safe 2:03's in race trim and 2:02's in hotlap/qualy. These are NOT fast lap times - not at all - but for me that was a huge improvement.
    • Where does 3 seconds come from? Check out the TL:DW series of videos from aris.drives on youtube. He explains it very well and how the fast guys can find 2 tenths every turn on a 10 turn track, gaining two seconds. That is really what it is about - how can I get 1 or 2 tenths on this next corner, and make it consistent so I get it every time.
    • Concentrate on improving one corner at a time - try and nail that one corner each lap and just relax for the rest of the lap and think about what you just did, how it went and plan what you are going to do the next time around. When you feel like you've improved that corner (note: improved, not perfected) - move on to another corner until you've improved that one. Start with the corner you suck the most at.
    • Hit. Every. Apex. This was such an 'omg I am dumb' moment for me as it is such common knowledge. But in practice, I'd been driving around happily getting withing a metre of an apex and accepting that was good enough. NO! There goes 1-2 tenths right there, just on the apex alone. The apex is god, you must worship it.
    • Later is not always better. Experiment with your braking points on every corner. General wisdom is that you should brake as late as possible and as hard as possible, but there are cases when you can gain time by braking a touch earlier. It is worth playing with this.
    Apologies if any of this is patronising - but these are some of the things I've come back to over and over and have helped me a lot. Beyond that, post up a lap and I'm sure the guys around here will have a lot of helpful tips!
    tezpez85, andyo450, Wally and 3 others like this.
  6. Jeremy Talbot

    Jeremy Talbot Rookie

    Posts:
    87
    Likes:
    184


    Have a look at this too. Nils is a very quick driver who does driver coaching as well. This video is in the mclaren so it's a direct comparison for you, albeit at Spa
    krunch and SteveDrivingSlowly like this.
  7. Flukey

    Flukey Rookie

    Posts:
    30
    Likes:
    49
    This may help mate on setup basics..
    I followed this and knocked three seconds off my time for Paul Ricard



    Ive had the game for a month and it humbled me to how bad I was when I used to be very competitive when it came to racing games but all I can say mate is just turn laps, maybe join the public servers and just learn to drive in traffic as compared to league races I dont get nervous on these servers..

    You'll get there mate :)
    krunch and SteveDrivingSlowly like this.
  8. krunch

    krunch ACC Server Legend Team Raceonoz Gold Member Super ROOZ

    Posts:
    711
    Likes:
    1,229
    Good on you for asking for help. Being open to advice is the best place to start. Onward and upward from there! (besides I get to quietly read all the advice from the others too which is very handy ;))

    In terms of being around other cars - as Steve said the only way to get better is to be around other cars! Jump into Wednesday night races as much as you can as you won't be ruining anyone's championship. That's where you can try different things such as a dive up the inside in a certain corner, or react to someone else doing the same, or setting up a criss cross. It also helps you to feel the limits of the car and how to catch it. Sometimes your fastest lap can have multiple 'moments' in it as you ride the limit.

    Also my mates and I have spent years doing 'scrimmage' for fun. That's where 3-5 of us would group up on track and then dice until someone got spun or went way off track and lost touch. We'd then all slow up until we'd regrouped and go again. We'd sometimes have epic battles or epic crashes but we learned a lot about racing close and all that comes with doing that.
  9. Sparksy84

    Sparksy84 Rookie

    Posts:
    34
    Likes:
    66
    Hey mate, if you're keen I'm happy to jump on and give a bit of feedback Fri/Sat/Sun over discord if you're free then





    Coach Dave's setups are also very good (for the aston at least) if you've got the cash, takes the guessing out of setup direction and lets me practice on track rather than fiddling with dampers until 7:30pm monday night. Made a world of difference.
    Last edited: May 26, 2020
    Jeremy Talbot likes this.
  10. andyo450

    andyo450 Team Driver Super ROOZ

    Posts:
    156
    Likes:
    349
    Smooth steering (and throttle to some degree) doesn't really work to well in the 720s. The front end is a bit lazy so you need to be a bit more forceful than usual with it to get it to go where you want. You can drive it around being smooth but it will leave a bit of time on the table.
    It's rare to find 1 second in setup over the default aggressive setups, ~.5sec is what I think I'm generally finding in setup ( and most of that is probably tyre pressures anyway), so at the stage your at your doing the right thing setting tyre pressures and not focusing on the rest of it.
    To give you advice on what to change or focus on to find time we need to see a video of a lap.
    A few basic things to remember though:
    -Use all the track width
    -Exits are more important than entries in the vast majority of corners.
    -The delta is the best tool you have to figure how the fastest way around a racetrack.
    -Pay attention to your reference points

    Youtube lap guides are a really good help for learning lines and giving you a vague idea of brake points and stuff, don't try to copy entry speeds and stuff because for the really quick laps there are a heap of subtleties in the way those guys drive that you won't be able to replicate straight away, it will only frustrate you trying. There's an onboard story from Dave Perel of him driving around Paul Ricard I watched ages ago, I learnt some alternative lines through corners that I hadn't really considered before. It really helped with my consistency through the slower speed corners on that track.
  11. squid

    squid Rookie

    Posts:
    58
    Likes:
    42
    Thanks heaps for all the ideas here, was way more response than I expected to get. I'll try to get a replay file up at some point once I've got some laps in - I have issues with recording video because I play on a HDR screen and the colours come out looking :):):):)ed on a standard screen. Expect to start seeing in the Wednesday races pretty regularly.